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No, this is /co/. We idolize bad animation like Fairly Oddparents, Wakfu, Total Drama Island, and Chowder.

>>19634952

And why not mention to Walt Disneys own Nine Old Men while I'm at it? These men are collectively responsible for all the best animation I know, And for delighting audiences for about seven decades so far, and I believe many more to come, even though the last one of them, Ollie Johnston passed away in 2008.

Or how about Freddy Moore? The guy who personally invented modern animation? Who created the look and feel of the early Disney? Who set an unreachable standard for warmth and appeal in his animation in Snowhite and Pinochio, and who became a mentor to Frank Thomas & Ollie Johnston, as well as all the other great Disney animators of that time.

>>19635193
Keep going. You're teaching me things.

>>19634952

Dayumn is it really possible that one snide remark was enough to completele kill this thread?

And also Don Bluth of course. Calling him an unsung hero would be obviously wrong, but I think he's being missinterpreted a lot. He went away from Disney when they no longeer held up the high standards set by uncle Walt through his work. He did so to maybe be able to create good animated features with derious plots and good quality. What people very rarely talk about is that Don Bluth at that time was practically the crown prince of Disney animation, sometimes called "the next Milt Kahl", so he gave up a lot for nothing more than a chance to try and brought us masterpieces like The Secret od NIMH, An American Tale, In a Land Before Time and All Dogs Go to Heaven. Sadly he was unable to find funding for such exceptional projects when Disney animation became relevant again. I'd also like to say that he has the most talent and understanding as far as characters in animated movies are concerned among all people living today, well he did study english literature so that's probably to be expected.

moar, please god we need better threads here

And while we're on the topic: Richard Williams.

He learned animation the HARD way. The list of his mentors reads like the Holy Bible. Ken Harris, Art Babbit (aka: The Arturian Legend), Milt Kahl and Frank Thomas to name just a few. Over his long career he was always reluctant to get with a major studio because he had a wish to create serious art. Therefore he did mostly commercials and merchandising stuff on his own (Yes, that doesn't just sound schizophrenic it is) and tried to create the a complete animated feature on his own. The story of this and how the work of about three decades and several million british pounds of his were wasted can be found on wikipedia, by searching for the Thief and the Cobbler.

What's more important though than any artistic exploit of his is that he is the author of The Animators Survival Kit, definately the best book on character animation, and that he's a beloved and respected teacher to every aspiring artist in the field today.

>>19634952
The original Looney Tunes cartoons were theatrical shorts and Walt Disneys cartoons were either theatrical shorts or full length films that had sufficient budgets and teams of animators working on them.

Don Bluth, Richard Williams all these guys worked on higher budget projects than television series. Limited animation techniques pioneered by companies like Hanna-Barbera were invented to make television cartoons affordable to produce.

You can't compare the quality of those shows to productions that had higher budgets and large teams of experienced animators working on them. It's like complaining that television sci-fi doesn't have the same quality special effects work as large budget films.

>>19635938

There is such a thing as good limited animation, you know. And Johnny Test and Fairly Odd-Parents ain't it.

What about Fleischer? I fucking love Fleischer Studios. Fleischer invented rotoscopy and IIRC made the firs cartoons with sound.

And maybe, in his own way, the greatest of them all; Ub Iwerks. (Together with his buddy Walt in the picture). He was the first partner that Walt Disney ever had, and probably the best one he could have wished for at the time.

After Lantz took the rights to Oswald the Lucky Rabbit from Walt, they also got all the animators to come over. All but Ub. He was an exceptionally productive artist, able to crank out up to 800 animation drawings a day(!!) if needed. Granted he was limmited to the crude cartoony style of the time but he intuitively put more life into, for example, the simple Mickey of Steamboat Willie than what many so-called animators are able to achieve today.

By the way: he drew almost all of Steamboat Willie. To the best of my knowledge only the animation of Minnie running after the boat was done by Les Clark.

>>19636003

The first sound cartoon was Steamboat Willie, though.

>>19635938
>You can't compare cheap animation to expensive animation.

See >>19635974
Besides, "it's too cheap to be good" is not a defense; it's simply... too cheap to be good. It's like paying a dime for a burger made out of shit and saying "well, it's made out of shit, but it only cost a dime." Sure, a $1 burger isn't as good as a $50 steak, but $1 is probably the lowest you can go before you /can't/ even make a burger for the money.

>>19636256
Yeah, just look at Happy Harry, that guy makes it for free, and he's better animating than a lot of "professionals".

>>19636043
damn...

>>19634952
there's something to this statement. I'd take the CN shows, the simpsons, futurama, adult swim, and macfarlanimation over the classic disney films any day.

really, I'm a sitcom fan who is just fed up with today's live action comedies.

it's just a coincidence that all the good shows are animated. that's where all the best writers are.

in conclusion, I am awesome for recognizing that I am not really a fan of animation, and am instead a fan of shows that are animated.

And one more animator I'd like to mention here. Mark Henn.

He's always very much over-shadowed by other modern animation legends like Andreas Deja or Eric Goldberg, but to me he's the very best, and I'll tell you why:

look at the characters Andreas Deja had the luck to be allowed to work on: Lilo, Gaston, Scar and Mama Odie just to name a few. They are all exciting and excentic, with great voices too. Not to speak off Eric's characters (Phil from Hercules, Genie from Alladin, Louis the singing alligator), for an animator those characters are very fun and reasonably easy to work on. Mark Henn always gets stuck with the hardest and most important character in the whole movie. NO EXCEPTIONS. Just a few to give you the gist of it: Fa Mulan, Princess Jasmin, Young Simba and even Belle. And all of those tough-ass asignments have been handled so tenderly and with so much attention to detail that they became great characters, out of almost nothing.

Plus Mark did the single best drawing in the whole goddamn Lion King.

>>19636592
That's... reasonable.

Okay guys that's more or less what I wanted to get out. Thanks to everybody who even took the time to read that Berlin wall of typo infested text.

Feel free to discuss or whatever while I'll just dump a bit of animation related art to put this thread to further good use.

Glen Keane cheat sheet.

>>19636959
>Solid? LOL you don't know anything about cartoons there's no such thing as "solid drawings"

This is supposed to be the first page.

>>19637061

Oh and btw feel free to request anything you want me to dump after I'm done with Barbara Ann.

>>19636592

At least you don't pretend that those shows are 'better' than the other, more well-animated cartoons. You just like what you like. Sounds fair to me.

>>19637161
>>19637171
>>19637183
>>19637237

Nice. I wish the show looked that good, more often.

>>19637320

Yeah, it's a real pitty. I still like it a whole lot anyways.

>>19637385
agreed

Now come the last five of Babsy.

Now what?

If nobody wants to see anything specific I'll just post whatever I stumble across in my folder for a while.

This is a good thread and you should feel good about it.

Here's Frank & Ollie on vacation in the Netherlands. Dem legal drugs man, dem drugs.

>>19637690

Glad you're enjoying it.

Also, I kind of liked Bolt. At last a step in the right direction.

>>19638251

this picture made me sad.

because it made me realize that they just don't make em like that anymore.

>>19638316

It's true. Sad, but true.

Why not mention Hayao Miyazaki? Every one of his feature films is considered a masterpiece.

>>19638360

I didn't mention him because this is /co/. You're absolutely right though, and I love Kiki's Delivery Service. I love how it's gentle all the time but still always poignant. I don't want to get ahead of myself but it almost reminds me of a Charles Dickens novel, in that regard.

And Osamu Tezuka. He's known as the "father of manga", but he also created at least a dozen television series and just as many animated films.

A few pages from a "Going-away-book" with many drawings and caticatures from awesome Disney artists.

>>19638800

Hey, it's proto-Homer Simpson!

>>19638907

CAN'T. EVER. UN-SEE.

Thanks for all this. I've been scouring around for more animation sheets and such. If you've got alot from the 90s disney renaissance films that would be great. Those are particularly hard to find.

>>19639091

Are you looking for character sheets or animation drawings?

>>19639091
Character sheets. Of alladin, in paticular?

>>19639182

Dude, where do you find all this stuff?

Also, helping the cause with some Alice.

all of it.

>>19639332

I collected it over some time, but all this Aladdin stuff is from here:

http://animationarchive.net/Feature%20Films/Aladdin/Model%20Sheets/index.php

>>19639411

So since you now have a link to all the Aladdin stuff here, I'll just post some more Mary Blair.

>>19639411
Awesome man. I found this link to be very useful too.
http://artofdisney.canalblog.com/

>>19636959
Glen Keane is amazing~
Hard to believe he's the son of the guy that created The Family Circus.

No, I ain't trollin'

>>19639543

Yeah that site has a lot of really great concept art and stuff. Pkus it's always awesome to read something in genuine French.

>>19639543
>>19639411
Cool. Danke.

>>19639612

I just KNOW that movie is going to give me a hair fetish. Just what I need: one more of those fuckers.

>>19639674

Kein Ding. Wozu sind anonyme Fremde im Intenet denn da?

>>19639645
Been a great resource for my alternate DVD cover project.

you know how animufags make videos showing off the work of various animators from different shows? kind of like a demo reel but made by fans.

why are there so few /co/ equivalents to that? I've only found maybe two or three people who do it.

>>19639824

I'm not up to date anymore it seems. I hadn't seen your Pinocchio one yet. It's great to see that your sticking to your project by the way. Very good.

>>19636921

Awesome AND informative. It's great to hear someone talk about a subject they love with such insight, intelligence and affection. Thanks anon!

>>19639870
Anime conventions host contests for the best fan-made spliced-together anime music video. American animation conventions do not hold contests because there are no American animation conventions.

>>19639870

I've never seen anything like that either. Maybe it's just because the western industry doesn't produce too much content to make those from.

Maybe you wanna check out this link though; there's some great animation there sorted by artists.

http://www.penciltestdepot.com/

>>19639895
Been posting more of my stuff at /coc/ now.
http://plus4chan.org/boards/coc/res/30009.html

And I'm also tinkering with doing the original Star Wars movies, using Ralph McQuarrie art.

>>19639978

Thank you very much for those kind words!

>>19639997

I really need to check there more often. Again, very good. I'll probably use them, if I ever get my DVDs back from all the various people I lent them too.

>>19640132
Well I have been making more progress in finishing some. Besides Dumbo and Fantasia pretty much being all but done, Peter Pan, Meet the Robinsons and Alice have also been progressing well.

>>19639982
But we have comic book conventions where we discuss western animation.

Also, we now have an annual Disney convention.

>>19640167

Are you going to do the whole shabang? I mean even the pictures that haven't even been released on DVD?

>>19640180
We've had Disney conventions for almost 30 years now with the Disneyana gatherings, it's only recently that we've gotten an official one in the form of the D23 Expo, though it's alternating between that and the shorter Destination D23.

If you know who made this, I'll give you a cookie.

>>19640237
Yeah, though it's pretty much a matter of amassing as much art as possible. Rescuers Down Under stuff has been eluding me for a long time (though I'm thinking I'll use art from a deleted scene in that Lost and Found book of Bernard having nightmares about Aborigine petroglyphs) and I've only just settled on an Aladdin cover piece

It's also a bitch to find stuff from the Package Features.

>>19640306

Bakshi.

Question. Since you guys probably know this a lot better than I would.

I've always appreciated how in Disney films the actual lips followed the speech believably. Unlike in cheap cartoons and Animu where they just flat out don't nine times out of ten.

So my quest is... was dialog rotoscoped?

>>19640337

No. Never. I can absolutely guarantee it. Except for when the wholecharacter is rotoscoped and probably not even then. Matching dialogue animation to the voice track is an art of its own, though. For example, for some as of yet unknown reason, you have to see the actual drawings a little sooner than you hear the sound from the speakers for it to seem even, and it's always different. There is a very short scene in Pinochio where the sound and picture are eight frames apart, just so that we as the audience perceive them at the same time. And that's not even going into actually drawing belivable and appealing mouth shapes. Milt Kahl used to watch singers a lot and study their mouhshapes. And even among the best animators at Disney there are som who are better at lipsyncing than others. Frank Thomas was a master a this and Eric Goldberg has it down very well too. My guess is just that most anime productions can't "waste" money on getting it 100% right.

GGNNHHHHGG my reference folder is going to BURST

postan Darkwing Duck

>>19640569

Correction: You have to delay the drawings, NOT the sound. Sorry.

>>19640689

>>19640569

Alright, I thought so. Yesterday in /a/ there was a thread about the best animated movie/show but it could not contain (or seem to contain) rotoscoping. Obviously that made things harder for people to submit. I was honestly considering just dropping Disney examples because it is pretty god damn hard to beat.

>>19640689

Now you wouldn't happen to have a good Buster Bunny model sheet, would you?

>>19640709

Yeah Disney has a way of hogging good animators. For some reason they even have the best 3D animators, even though they joined that game kind of late.

>>19640704
fuckin' LAUNCHPAD, that suave motherfucker.

>>19640815
and the adorable Gosalyn

>>19640808
And yet quite a few of them have jumped ship to Dreamworks because one can actually have a steady job there

Kinda surprised no one put this up yet...

>>19640841

Seriously man. Gosalyn is a marvel of design. There is no objective thing to her that would qualify as "cute" but she still is.

>>19640848

Which I can understand. I wish Disney would go back to their old model of snatching people from college and never letting them go.

THIS is art. Suck it DeviantFags.

>>19640972
Imagineering's also being hit pretty hard now. Shanghai Disneyland's going to be mostly outsourced to other theme park firms.

>>19640252
The Disney conventions[D23] is right across from Disneyland. What gives?

>>19640569
>>19640337
Actually in Japan, and other areas like India and Europe, they animate first and then ADR the actors in. Here we record voices first and then animate to that. In Europe they lip flap because they often try to market to several multilingual countries, so they have to deal with dubs.

>>19641092

Yeah I pitty those guys. When Eisner realized that adding one Dollar to the ticket price would earn them an additional 60 million a year, the last bit of Walts dream got shat on, and today the parks are under the same pressure as the movies; make money or suffer.

>>19641211

Now that makes sense.

And here's the Nine Old Men when they were still young.

>>19635508
Good to see someone mentioning me!

>>19641597

Awesome people being mentioned in an awesome thread. Nothing out of the ordinary.

>everything here

From Wizards. Not sure if it was drawn by Bakshi himself, but this Elinore design kicks ASS. The Peace one is weird, though.

I'm kinda suprised no one mentioned Maurice Nobel. His sense of design is SO AWESOME HOLY SHIT GOUACHE.

>>19638316
are you kidding, all the disney girls and boys are based off that formula

>>19642198

True enough I think I remember someone posting a lot of 101 Dalmations concepts he did.

John K approves of the pretentiousness of this thread

>>19642239

>101 Dalmations

I meant Bambi. Goddamn its getting late.

>>19642289

but John K.

Disney.

>>19642302

The namefaggotry made this post so much more amusing.

/co/, wtf are you doing? ARCHIVE THIS IMMEDIATELY.

>>19642354

Okay. Needs three more though right?

This makes me wish I hadn't lost all my Thief and the Cobbler concept art.

>>19642411

I know his bro Tom did Mushu but I don't know what other characters, do you?

Okay guys, image limit reached. I had a lot of fun, thanks for keeping it classy all around.

Have some Fred Moore and a very good night.

:)

>>19642508

He did some of Iago in Aladdin, Tuke in Brother Bear, Young Simba in The Lion King and Pocahontas herself. He also worked on Tarzan and Atlantis as Aditional animator. Mushu was his only gig as supervising animator, as far as I know.

Archive this!

>>19641473
>>19641458

>the water's coming in!!!
>please pull me up :(

oh man, memories.

bunch of hipster shit.

>>19643091
You shut the fuck up. I know, obvious troll is obvious but damnit.

Also, someone archived.

>>19643124

That's good news.